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January 28, 2005 12:03 AM
Broken: Padlocked safety valve
TIB reader "ima cow" points out a problem at the school's science lab: the the natural gas shutoff is padlocked in the 'on' position. From the look of the dust on the handle, it's been that way for some time.
I'd second that it's locked OFF.
It reminds me (in a slightly different way) of a school where I used to work, and the air-conditioning unit (external part) was in a locked cage, and the isolation switch was just next to the cage, but outside. Every lunchtime kids would sit on the cage, and turn off the a/c. After every lunch I would go back to my room, and it would be hot as hell, because there had been no cool air for the past half hour.
I desperately wanted to be able to lock that switch ON.
it seems odd to me that it would be locked off...
i remember doing lots of chemistry labs involving natural gas burners. and like he says, it does look like its been in that position for a long time.
could it be that this chem lab just doesnt do any experiments using gas?
I'd go one step further and say that it's padlocked off because of construction in the area. It looks like there is dust on the padlock, the ball-valve, and the elbow, etc. Doesn't look broken to me.
I think the reader should have provided a picture of which position in was in. i.e. one that included the on off labels, and i agree with schube, the extreme amount of dust is far more than that of just unuse.
I think the reader should have provided a picture of which position in was in. i.e. one that included the on off labels, and i agree with schube, the extreme amount of dust is far more than that of just unuse.
I think the reader should have provided a picture of which position in was in. i.e. one that included the on off labels, and i agree with schube, the extreme amount of dust is far more than that of just unuse.
Not all valves turn off when the lever is perpendicular to the pipe. Without more information we have no way of knowing whether it's locked on or off.
fluffy
That's a ball valve and they ALL are shut when the handle is perpendicular to the stem. Industry standard, and all that.
That is a ball valve, and it is definitely in the OFF position. Seems to me, that the lock would be opened, when there was a responsible adult/instructor present to turn ON the gas for instruction or teaching. No problem here.
Yes the ball valve is off! The handle is designed to work in conjunction with the padlock loop. The "safety factor" is locking the valve shut when performing maintenance. No one wants an idiot turning on the valve when your working on something at the other end. As for the dust, do you honestly expect someone to clean off the valve every week? Also, the handle and valve stem are "keyed alike". If you remove the handle and flip it around it retains the correct position for on and off.
Yeah, it's industry standard that perpendicular is off. If that valve is locked on, it is one-of-a-kind and also a highly illegal valve as well as an insane safety hazard.
There should be a picture of the labels.
And, you would not belive how stupid the schools are, I have no doubt that someone would have pad-locked it on. At my school, some of the faucets in the bathrooms have the handels labeled on the wrong side. Or labeled both cold or both hot.
I would not be the least bit suprised if it was a teacher or someone that just got mad that whenever they needed the gas, someone had bumped it and was off and they had to flip the valve back on.
At my school, the gas on/off is behind the teacher's desk and is a KEYED SWITCH!! Meaning, if something goes wrong, only someone with a key can turn it back off.
The valve is OFF and locked as it should be if not in use.
However, the pipe nipple with the screwed cap is of concern. A mischeavous kid with a small pipe wrench or pliers could take the cap off. This particular valve does not protect against that possibility.
That depends on which way the gas flows.
If it's on the side that's shut-off then there is no problem.
If it's on the inlet side then people need to start trusting teenagers more than they are.
at our school the valves are just like that for each gas outlet...and turned like that is on and off, one side turns it off, the other turns it on...as a matter of fact, i remember the strong smell of gas just the other day in there...
Bob, as to:
"At my school, the gas on/off is behind the teacher's desk and is a KEYED SWITCH!! Meaning, if something goes wrong, only someone with a key can turn it back off."
That key probably only turns the gas back on, there should be a button or switch to turn it off at any time, as in, during an emergency. When I was in high school, each lab had a gas OFF switch with a key to turn it back on at the exit.
At my school they tell us that if the valve makes an 'L', then it's off. They didn't really say anything about where the emergence cutoff was, though.
I think the dust is chalk dust. If you look at the top left corner of the picture, you can see what looks like the edge of a blackboard.
Um, no.
The gas is keyed on/off.
There is no way to turn off the supply without the key.
The main switch is behind the teacher's desk and there are handeles on the student desks.
The handels turn the gas on/off at that valve only.
Here's a story from today.
I was staying after school with several other people. The teacher was there too. Well, after a while we notice a wierd smell. We determine that it's nothing that we're doing. I say "it smells something like gas". (rotten eggs)
The teacher checks all the valves on the student desks and they are off. She notices that the teacher cutoff (keyed switch) is in the ON posision. She says "oh, here's the problem" and turns it off.
She then said "the gas leaks if it's on for a while"
Meaning that there is nothing that anyone could have done if they noticed it. No one except the teacher has the key.
The pipe nipple with cap is actually broken. The purpose of this is to catch debris particles moving through the pipe with the gas. This "cleanout" should be installed to catch such debris. If the gas is flowing from the wall, to the valve, and then down, this cleanout won't be effective catching anything. It should be installed lower, at an elbow in the pipe, not in a straight run which it appears to be in the above picture.
If you look under the sign, you will see two screw holes and a larger hole. There WAS something there... perhaps that WAS the emergency shutoff. There is another hole just to the left of the sign. None-the-less, the valve is locked in the off position.
Eric may have had the only true "this is broken" observation.
Oh and WHY would anyone other than the teacher have the key?!??!
No one other than the teacher should have the key.
But there should be some other means that a student could use to trigger an emergancy shutoff.
Such as a valve after the keyed switch. (both the switch and the valve would have to be on for gas to work)
In an emergancy, anyone could shut it off.
It's OFF, as noted.
The holes in the back of that panel look like they might be for plumbing (hot, cold, drain) rather than gas... The hot/cold seem kinda small for that, but the alignment is sure spot-on.
The pipe nipple looks more like that's where something else used to connect in, down-stream of the OFF valve, as it should be, and they've capped it to prevent a leak if somebody manages to open the valve.
To those talking about labels, THERE ARE NO LABELS. The handle/valve is either in-line with the pipe, or perpindicular, and that's all the label anybody who should be messing with that valve needs.
in-line == open
perpindicular == closed
Even I know that, and I don't know squat about gas lines.
The teacher said "the gas leaks if it's on for a while"??? HUH? The teacher said that with no concern? What about health hazards and the possibility of an explosion? Get the gas company in there to check for leaks.
Interesting. I sure hope they have no need to shut that off, fire, leak, extreme pressure build. THAT could be bad. Yet strangely funny :)
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Sounds like something that's sufficiently broken that the local Fire Marshall should be notified.
Posted by: Brooks Moses at January 28, 2005 02:05 AM